Don’t go around saying at my opinion is that when it is not true. I don’t want to “only have fun as a antag” what i want is remove a item at was clearly made for powergaming cap/hop players. I don’t have problems with the secglasses and i don’t know why you keep saying it as if i want seglasses also removed. I even mentioned they are healthy to the game because it helps cadets.
Please give a actual reason for why admin glasses should exist instead of trying to say this things.
(I am having flashbacks of when i proposed to nerf captain’s gear back when his gear was pretty op dear god)
It’s just quick information and a cool QOL item. HOP can quickly identify a persons job without having to scroll through the nightmare of the manifest. Same with cap. It’s a cool item that cap and hop can have and it does not affect the balance at all. I’ve really no idea how you’re claiming it’s power gaming when you can’t even see if they are wanted or not. At most it allows you to identify a person who has switched ID’s if you recognise their character from a previous encounter, but that just makes it more realistic. (Most of the time you won’t naturally notice it however)
Like if this is really all powergaming, I dunno why you stop at sec glasses. Should cap and hop loss sec radio access because it allows them to listen to what sec is doing?
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You should read the whole thread before making these assumptions.
The main reason i consider admin glasses a powergamer item is because of the timing where the pr was made and when it was added into the game (both RIGHT after secglasses were made sec only, if i remember correctly it literally got added 2 days after the secglasses thing) and for what roles they were made (coveniently the two roles at loved to steal secglasses from sec the most, and some still do even if it is not legal anymore).
I can somewhat agree at for hop it can be considered a QOL item if it is just used for they job but sadly that wasn’t the original intention behind the creation of the item. The reason why i stop with secglasses is because unlike admin glasses they ARE real QOL and were made for be QOL. Sec already had bootleg secglasses in the form of sunglasses and sec hud for a very long time and the item already existed behind sci research and later as a warden/hos item only before becoming normal sec gear. Unlike hop/cap sec does need to always check the wanted status and the ids of the crew at all times, more recent sec update take into account the secglasses as part of they main gear (the wanted console rework for example) and before they were added everyone already knew at they had to avoid sec at all times if they were antags so it didn’t chage anything once it was added as normal gear (besides making impersonating heads harder as now sec could mindshield check you at all times and not just the hos).
Basically the secglasses were made as a true QOL item at didn’t change much the game, they existed for a long time and sec does need them at all times. On the other hand admin glasses were made out of the blue for cap/hop right after these two roles lost they legal access to secglasses (and i am pretty sure the reasoning behind this was exactly for nerf sechop and seccap).
You literally said it was the ideal solution to remove SecGlasses in response to another reply. Powergaming is also not a rule so no it is not powergaming for cap/hop players. Captains are literally supposed to help all departments including security. They should know exactly what ID people have or not.
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I consider it the idea solution because it straight up removes the need of discuss if other heads should also have similar gear at secglasses. In that same answer i said i rather KEEP the secglassesas as well so i don’t know wht you are using it as a argument.
Saying at powergaming is not a rule now (it has been a rule for a long time, it just was not implemented to the new rule rework) as a excuse to keep a bad item is not right. And while captain is a job at can indeed help other departments it doesn’t mean they can do that the whole shift, specially for sec, there is a reason why they lost access to secglasses and why seccap is not accepted unless there is literally no sec. Excluding seccap there is no other reason for cap to ses ids.
So far the only reason why this item should exist at was brought up so far was at is a QOL item for hop. Instead of trying to say at i am wrong (poorly) i would like to hear why else do you think this item should stay, you know, FEEDBACK.
You know what i think you are right with keeping the glasses for hop now, i still think the creation of item was for a completely different intention but since hop can actually use them for they work they may as well keep it for QOL.
I’d not complain if qm had them too, cause I’d constantly be checking ids anyway to decide if the person needs the highly suspect item they’re requesting. On to of people wearing command items looking like that command member.
Wouldn’t it be easier to just ask for the right stamps (for example if they want ammo you ask them for hos/cap stamp) instead of checking the id?
No, because I don’t care if somebody in command trusts this very annoying tider with cap cloak, I’m not giving them a multitool.
I honestly disagree, if i see a tider come with the right stamps and command confirms they are real (even if it is just for a multitool) for me they can have the stuff they want.
Ok but that’s how you wanna play, I play as a stingy non-reasoning QM. The choice being there is what makes it fun. Removing that choice is more problematic to me. And like how these admin glasses work. If you don’t get hop or cap them, they will just take sec glasses anyway and I’d prefer them have admin glasses.
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secglasses are sec only, the ONLY head at can take them legally without breaking space law is HOS.
And you no need admin goggles for play as a stingy QM (is likely at most of the time cap and hop won’t give you they goggles anyways).
It also states “may be considered contraband” not “IS contraband”, hence HOS or Wardens choice to allow them. Which 9 out of 10 times, they can see a reason for why certain players may use them.
While this is true i have yet to see a captain who actually goes through with that and gets secglasses… and i say this as someone who only plays on LRP, the one place where you would see this happen often.
I mean caps the one that authorises major contra, so theres a bit of an issue (at least from an ic perspective) with saying that they can’t have them anyway tbh. Like I can just say I am authorising my use of it anyways.
Personally i think admin glasses are good
kind of a different topic, that would push this off topic. It’s more an RP mindset that I think needs to be explored more. Cause cap can authorise stuff for sure, but ultimately the respective departments get the final say at the same time (Like cap trying to authorise a weapon that command and sec can authorise - HOS doesn’t have to agree)
have you been ignoring all my posts? including the one you are replying to? should captains just stay in bridge all shift and only handle executions/court sessions? or should they do what they’re actually intended to do which is help the entire station and prioritize the safety of crew members. captains NEED to be able to see IDs from a distance to do their job properly. they help ALL departments when needed and sec is a department last time i checked. stop making up fake rules about powergaming when it literally isnt a thing.
That was the point of the tradeoff, and it gave science a reason to (or not) research sectech.
At the fundamental level, we’re going to disagree on what the correct solution on this is.
I personally very much preferred the old system where it was a choice that sec had to make, between abilitiy to use flashbangs and area hand flashes, and seeing wanted and HUD status at a glance.
Again, every secoff now starts with a full wanted list in their PDA. I feel that secglasses get in the way of this new function.
Admin glasses and HUDs were implemented initially as a tool to check issued IDs to see if they had the correct job icon. They’re effectively budget secglasses (glasses are flash protection) but without access to the wanted list. However both people who have access to this have a security channel on their headset.
If you move these behind research, I think a lot of the “powergaming” stigma behind a lot of these items will go away. (I’m well aware there are no powergaming rules anymore, in place of the contraband system as is.)
Secglasses have only status. PDA got notes, exceptions, current reason so they compliment eachother, especially till we get some more wanted list statuses. If sec only looks at status on sechud, antags that set off fake warrants can cause quite bit of chaos due to sec incompetency. 